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Revelation 3:3

Scott Lawson wrote: At Revelation 3:19 the aorist is used and I note that BDAG gives the gloss μετανόησον = take counsel with yourself but I wonder if “show yourself repentant” or “show repentance” are possible so as to reflect the active voice? I realize that BDAG’s gloss seems to reflect a middle voice. How does the voice affect the force of the imperative whether present or aorist?

The verb μετανοεῖν appears only in the active in the GNT; LSJ doesn’t indicate any middle-passive usage either. There’s no need to imagine any middle notion here; the verb itself implicitly indicates mental transformation. I note that NET gives simply “repent” for μετανόησον in Rev 3:3. Statistics: Posted by cwconrad — September 18th, 2012, 3:02 pm

/////////////////////////////////////////// New Testament Re: Matt 3:2 μετανοεῖτε

Posted: 18 Sep 2012 08:11 AM PDT http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/bgreek/~3/PPBgeMQxQ3w/viewtopic.php?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

At Revelation 3:19 the aorist is used and I note that BDAG gives the gloss μετανόησον = take counsel with yourself but I wonder if “show yourself repentant” or “show repentance” are possible so as to reflect the active voice? I realize that BDAG’s gloss seems to reflect a middle voice. How does the voice affect the force of the imperative whether present or aorist? Statistics: Posted by Scott Lawson — September 18th, 2012, 11:11 am

/////////////////////////////////////////// New Testament Re: Matt 3:2 μετανοεῖτε

Posted: 18 Sep 2012 05:07 AM PDT http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/bgreek/~3/fenhUaXhgJo/viewtopic.php?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

Alan Patterson wrote: Carl,

Where exactly do we disagree? I believe I am in agreement with your answer. I agree they are to get started (Present Tense Imperative). Here are my words: all of you get started immediately.

I did not get the sense that Stephen was asking about the definition of μετανοεῖτε. However, I can see where we disagree on this. A “radical reorientation” is closer to the finish line. The first step, at the starting line, is an act of the volition to chose a different course of action. I guess we are getting off the subject at hand… sorry.

You’re right; I think we do come down on the same side of the question of the present imperative. My reaction to your response was perhaps a reaction to your “There is no time to waste!” — which is indeed, I think, the implication of ἤγγικεν ὁ καῖρος. I get “radical reorientation” from μετανοεῖν; although it’s said to represent Hebrew shuv, it’s so often Englished as “repent” — which suggests to me more a confession of sin and recommitment. I think what’s implied here is, if I may borrow the phrasing, an “extreme makeover” of a person’s orientation toward everything. Granted that it’s a long-term process, what’s called for is a start of a long and painstaking process. I thought that both the start and the process should be emphasized in an understanding of the present imperative; an aorist can, I think, have an inceptive force for a long-term process, while the imperfective emphasizes the ongoing process as much as its start. Statistics: Posted by cwconrad — September 18th, 2012, 8:07 am

/////////////////////////////////////////// New Testament Re: Matt 3:2 μετανοεῖτε

Posted: 18 Sep 2012 04:17 AM PDT http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/bgreek/~3/o_gWtsNmbMs/viewtopic.php?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

Carl,

Where exactly do we disagree? I believe I am in agreement with your answer. I agree they are to get started (Present Tense Imperative). Here are my words: all of you get started immediately.

I did not get the sense that Stephen was asking about the definition of μετανοεῖτε. However, I can see where we disagree on this. A “radical reorientation” is closer to the finish line. The first step, at the starting line, is an act of the volition to chose a different course of action. I guess we are getting off the subject at hand… sorry. Statistics: Posted by Alan Patterson — September 18th, 2012, 7:17 am

/////////////////////////////////////////// What does this text mean? Re: ANGELO of Rev 2:1

Posted: 18 Sep 2012 03:35 AM PDT http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/bgreek/~3/JhFwQAYy45c/viewtopic.php?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

Why make this so complicated? You have the word γράφω. It is often used with the dative of indirect object, the one to whom you write. Human agency is normally represented with a preposition, such as διά. I simply can’t imagine anyone reading this of any other construction here. Statistics: Posted by Barry Hofstetter — September 18th, 2012, 6:35 am

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