Hebrews 2:17

Heb 2:17 John Oaklands j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au
Fri May 7 07:10:42 EDT 1999

Luke 4:5 UPAKOUW + case? HiDoes any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? Towhat extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is sayingin the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tensea bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,KATA PANTA?John===John V. Oaklands31/115 Main RoadCardiff NSW 2285AustraliaPhone 02 4954 4665FAX 02 4953 7097Email j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au_________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Luke 4:5UPAKOUW + case?

Heb 2:17 John Oaklands j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au
Fri May 7 07:10:42 EDT 1999

Luke 4:5 UPAKOUW + case? HiDoes any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? Towhat extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is sayingin the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tensea bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,KATA PANTA?John===John V. Oaklands31/115 Main RoadCardiff NSW 2285AustraliaPhone 02 4954 4665FAX 02 4953 7097Email j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au_________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Luke 4:5UPAKOUW + case?

Heb 2:17 Carlton Winbery winberyc at popalex1.linknet.net
Sun May 9 21:38:23 EDT 1999

classical greek John 5:26 John Oaklands wrote;> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To>what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is saying>in the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean>*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tense>a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,>KATA PANTA?> I would ask to what extent we can ever translate completely from Greek toEnglish. We must try and use words, phrases, etc. that can convey what weperceive the original writer is thinking (no mean task of its own).Having said that I would point that hOMOIOW is often used in situationswhere we would say “something is like something else,” or “to what shall Iliken this?” The word in Heb. 2:17 is in what we all learned to call theaor. passive and learned to translate “to be likened” or “to be made like.”The extent to which the English word conveys the meaning of the Greek termmight be indicated by KATA PANTA “in all things,” or perhaps “completely.””He must be made like to (his) brothers in all things so that . . .” It isinteresting that the Latin has SIMILARE here. Beyond this point thisdiscussion will get somewhat Christological, which is one reason I teachNew Testament and Greek not systematic theology. I read systematic theologyout of interest and also when I have trouble falling asleep.Dr. Carlton L. WinberyFoggleman Professor of ReligionLouisiana Collegewinbery at andria.lacollege.eduwinberyc at popalex1.linknet.netPh. 1 318 448 6103 hmPh. 1 318 487 7241 off

classical greekJohn 5:26

Heb 2:17 Carlton Winbery winberyc at popalex1.linknet.net
Sun May 9 21:38:23 EDT 1999

classical greek John 5:26 John Oaklands wrote;> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To>what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is saying>in the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean>*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tense>a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,>KATA PANTA?> I would ask to what extent we can ever translate completely from Greek toEnglish. We must try and use words, phrases, etc. that can convey what weperceive the original writer is thinking (no mean task of its own).Having said that I would point that hOMOIOW is often used in situationswhere we would say “something is like something else,” or “to what shall Iliken this?” The word in Heb. 2:17 is in what we all learned to call theaor. passive and learned to translate “to be likened” or “to be made like.”The extent to which the English word conveys the meaning of the Greek termmight be indicated by KATA PANTA “in all things,” or perhaps “completely.””He must be made like to (his) brothers in all things so that . . .” It isinteresting that the Latin has SIMILARE here. Beyond this point thisdiscussion will get somewhat Christological, which is one reason I teachNew Testament and Greek not systematic theology. I read systematic theologyout of interest and also when I have trouble falling asleep.Dr. Carlton L. WinberyFoggleman Professor of ReligionLouisiana Collegewinbery at andria.lacollege.eduwinberyc at popalex1.linknet.netPh. 1 318 448 6103 hmPh. 1 318 487 7241 off

classical greekJohn 5:26

Heb 2:17 Edgar Krentz ekrentz at lstc.edu
Mon May 10 12:09:57 EDT 1999

FW: virus warning FW: virus warning >Hi> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To>what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is saying>in the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean>*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tense>a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,>KATA PANTA?> >JohnYou raise an interesting question, which reverberates in Pau’ls use ofhOMOIWMA in Rom 8:3 [cf. 6:5] and Phil 2:7. Years ago Ernst Kaesemannsuggested in his lectures on NT theology that there is a doctiraldissertation lurking in this noun and related verbs in the NT. It remainsto be written.++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Edgar KrentzProfessor of New Testament EmeritusLutheran School of Theology at Chicago1100 E. 55th StreetChicago, IL 60615 USA773-256-0752e-mail: ekrentz at lstc.edu (Office) emkrentz at mcs.com (Home)+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

FW: virus warningFW: virus warning

Heb 2:17 Edgar Krentz ekrentz at lstc.edu
Mon May 10 12:09:57 EDT 1999

FW: virus warning FW: virus warning >Hi> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To>what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express what this is saying>in the Greek? There are those who would want to make this to mean>*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he word, mood and tense>a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase, as some translate,>KATA PANTA?> >JohnYou raise an interesting question, which reverberates in Pau’ls use ofhOMOIWMA in Rom 8:3 [cf. 6:5] and Phil 2:7. Years ago Ernst Kaesemannsuggested in his lectures on NT theology that there is a doctiraldissertation lurking in this noun and related verbs in the NT. It remainsto be written.++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Edgar KrentzProfessor of New Testament EmeritusLutheran School of Theology at Chicago1100 E. 55th StreetChicago, IL 60615 USA773-256-0752e-mail: ekrentz at lstc.edu (Office) emkrentz at mcs.com (Home)+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

FW: virus warningFW: virus warning

Heb 2:17 John Oaklands j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au
Mon May 10 19:55:23 EDT 1999

classical greek, John 5:26 Adonis Say, Edgar, that’s interesting. I like the thought that some things wejust can’t adequately say in a few words. Please let me know when thatdoctoral dissertation comes out in print.John— Edgar Krentz <ekrentz at lstc.edu> wrote:> >Hi> >> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word> hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To> >what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express> what this is saying> >in the Greek? There are those who would want to> make this to mean> >*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he> word, mood and tense> >a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase,> as some translate,> >KATA PANTA?> >> >John> > You raise an interesting question, which> reverberates in Pau’ls use of> hOMOIWMA in Rom 8:3 [cf. 6:5] and Phil 2:7. Years> ago Ernst Kaesemann> suggested in his lectures on NT theology that there> is a doctiral> dissertation lurking in this noun and related verbs> in the NT. It remains> to be written.> > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> Edgar Krentz> Professor of New Testament Emeritus> Lutheran School of Theology at Chicago> 1100 E. 55th Street> Chicago, IL 60615 USA> 773-256-0752> e-mail: ekrentz at lstc.edu (Office)> emkrentz at mcs.com (Home)> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> > > >> home page: http://sunsite.unc.edu/> You are currently subscribed to as:> j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au> To unsubscribe, forward this message to> $subst(‘Email.Unsub’)> To subscribe, send a message to> subscribe- at franklin.oit.unc.edu> > > ===John V. Oaklands31/115 Main RoadCardiff NSW 2285AustraliaPhone 02 4954 4665FAX 02 4953 7097Email j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au_________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

classical greek, John 5:26Adonis

Heb 2:17 John Oaklands j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au
Mon May 10 19:55:23 EDT 1999

classical greek, John 5:26 Adonis Say, Edgar, that’s interesting. I like the thought that some things wejust can’t adequately say in a few words. Please let me know when thatdoctoral dissertation comes out in print.John— Edgar Krentz <ekrentz at lstc.edu> wrote:> >Hi> >> >Does any one have any thoughts on the word> hOMOIWQHNAI in Heb 2:17? To> >what extent *like*? Is English adequate to express> what this is saying> >in the Greek? There are those who would want to> make this to mean> >*equal*, but to me that seems to be stretching he> word, mood and tense> >a bit. Or does this link with the earlier phrase,> as some translate,> >KATA PANTA?> >> >John> > You raise an interesting question, which> reverberates in Pau’ls use of> hOMOIWMA in Rom 8:3 [cf. 6:5] and Phil 2:7. Years> ago Ernst Kaesemann> suggested in his lectures on NT theology that there> is a doctiral> dissertation lurking in this noun and related verbs> in the NT. It remains> to be written.> > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> Edgar Krentz> Professor of New Testament Emeritus> Lutheran School of Theology at Chicago> 1100 E. 55th Street> Chicago, IL 60615 USA> 773-256-0752> e-mail: ekrentz at lstc.edu (Office)> emkrentz at mcs.com (Home)> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> > > >> home page: http://sunsite.unc.edu/> You are currently subscribed to as:> j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au> To unsubscribe, forward this message to> $subst(‘Email.Unsub’)> To subscribe, send a message to> subscribe- at franklin.oit.unc.edu> > > ===John V. Oaklands31/115 Main RoadCardiff NSW 2285AustraliaPhone 02 4954 4665FAX 02 4953 7097Email j_m_oaklands at yahoo.com.au_________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

classical greek, John 5:26Adonis

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